Smith, John, C.B. (Digest of his Evidence)—continued. 
Section 23 of the Bankruptcy Act of 1S90 which provides for a limitation of the rate of 
interest to 5 per cent, per annum where a debt has been proved upon a debtor’s estate 
under the principal Act, 3588-3602 Result of witness’ consideration of the fore 
going evasions that he submits a proposed addition to Section 23; explanations thereon, 
3602-3612. 3622-3647. 3677-3691. 
Steps taken by witness for obtaining from the Official Receivers information on 
various points in connection with money lending transactions in bankruptcy cases, 
3613-3621 Statement as to Section 23 of the Act of 1890 having no operation in 
cases of composition ; views of witness as to the inodific ition desirable on this point, 
3622-3631. 
Difficulties in the way of county court judges intervening in contracts between bor 
rowers and money lenders, and modifying the rate of interest when very exorbitant and 
excessive. 3648-3663 Failure of many money-lending limited companies; these 
carry out the provisions of the Companies’ Act, as a 1010,3664-3689 Explanations 
in connection with the practice as to the publication and filing of balance-sheets by 
money-lending companies, 3670-3676. 
Smith, Judge Lumley. (Digest of his Evidence.)—Wimess has been Judge of the 
Westminster County Court since 1893; has had experience as to money-lending com 
panies, 4624-4626. 
Full particulars respecting the system of the London and Westminster Loan and 
Discount Company, which has, perhaps, about 2,000 actions now in progress; details 
concerning ihe results of the company’s actions in the courts in 1895; 4627-4640. 4648 
et seq. Explanation that loan offices, as in Westminster, have certain favourable 
features, such as method, good book-keeping, and similar treatment towards all their 
customers, 4641. 4649. 
Paucity of charges of fraud against loan offices ; occasional complaints, however, 
against their system and iiigh interest, which latter frequently proves to be far more 
than the boriower at first supposes, 4642-4648. 4690-4696 Small experience of 
witness as to bills of sale, which do not give birth to much litigation nowadays, 4650. 
System usually adopted by witness where a loan office threatens to put in an execu 
tion in a poor man’s bouse, 4651. 4655, 4656 Doctrine of the Court of Chancery as 
to young men who borrow on the security of their expectations ; desirability of extending 
the jurisdiction of the Court of Chancery to the county courts, 4657-4667 Desira 
bility of extending the powers conferred by Section 7 of the Bills of Sale Act, 1882, to 
the county courts, 4667. 
Opinion that copies of all documents signed by a borrower or his surety should be 
supplied to the latter, 4667, 4668 Recommendation that, provided money lenders 
are considered necessary, imprisonment for debt should not be abolished in cases of 
money lending, 4668-4671. 
Difficulty of dealing with cases of bills of sale as security for money; misery arising 
from bills of sale and the hire-purchase system, 4672-4678 Views of witness respecting 
the abolition of the usury laws, 4679-4682 Objection to Justice Byles’s proposal 
that 10 percent, only should be legally recovered without prejudice to what the man 
had voluntarily paid or agreed to pay, 4683-4689. 
Restricted nature of the equitable jurisdiction of the county courts, 4697-4700 
Explanation that witness has always disallowed fines in his court; opinion that a fine is 
a penalty, 4701-4706. 
Statement that the rate of interest charged by the loan offices which come to witness’ 
court is about 13 or 14 per cent., 4707,4708 Frequent cases of ignorance on the 
part of sureties as to the documents they sign ; impracticability of a system for com 
pleting all loans before a magistrate, 4709, 4710. 
Smith, Mrs. M. J. (Brighton). Inability of witness, without his books, to go into the 
case of Mrs. M. J. Smith, a borrower at Brighton, Kirkwood 4270-4272. 4 2 99~43 l 3 
Information in connection with some small loans by Mr. Kirkwood to Mrs. M. J. 
Smith, of Brighton, in January 1889 and subsequently, in respect ot which a loss of 
less than 201. was eventually incurred ; reluctance of witness to admit that any fraudu 
lent return was made to deceive the Income Tax Commissioners as to the amount of this 
loss, Goodman 4314-4342. 
South, Mrs. Grounds upon which witness defends his threats to proceed with the utmost 
rigour of the law against a Mrs. South, the wife of a doctor in Kensington, who bor 
rowed money from him without her husband’s knowledge, of which concealment witness 
was aware at the time; he lost his money in this case, Gordon 3212—3226. 
Southern Counties Deposit Bank. Investigation by witness of the operations of the 
Southern Counties Deposit Bank, Limited ; numerous bills of sale taken by this bank 
at very high rates of interest from small farmers, dairymen, and others, Farrow 5. 
0.142. X x Witness