Report from the Select Committee on Slave Trade (East Coast of Africa); together with the proceedings of the Committee, minutes of evidence, appendix and index

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Monograph

Identifikator:: 832922498

URN:: urn:nbn:de:zbw-retromon-79587

Document type:: Monograph

Title:: Report from the Select Committee on Slave Trade (East Coast of Africa); together with the proceedings of the Committee, minutes of evidence, appendix and index

Place of publication:: [London]

Publisher:: [The House of Commons]

Year of publication:: 1871

Scope:: 1 Online-Ressource (XXIV, 242 S.)

Collection:: Economics Books

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24 MINUTES OF EVIDENCE TAKEN BEFOßE SELECT COMMITTEE Mr. that is what makes me think that whatever treaty Churchill, we might make with Zanzibar, and whatever — money we might spend, we shall not be able to 13 July put a stop, to the slave trade totally, because it is ^^71. carried on beyond the limits of the Sultan of Zanzibar’s dominions, as well as within them ; that was on the Somali coast. 312. Sir. J. Hay.'\ Were they taken by Arab dhows ?—Yes. 313. Viscount Enfield.'] Are any of the slaves destined for Madagascar ? — To some extent they are. Those taken from the southern part of the dominions of the Sultan, namely, from Kilwa to the south towards Cape Delgado, and even from the Portuguese territory, are carried to Madagascar ; some are taken to the Comoro Island; these are more for the French who use them as liberated slaves ; they are taken to Mohilla; people come across from the French possessions, and the Arabs sell them to them. The French are allowed to buy slaves, and they are liberated, or nominally liberated immediately, and sent to the plantations for a certain number of years. 314. Sir J. Hay.] For 10 years service?— Five years. 315. illiairman7\ You have heard, of course, the terms of the suggested new treaty ?—Yes; I received instructions from the Foreign Office to propose them to Syed Majid, which I did when I reached Zanzibar. I embodied them in an Arabic letter, and sent them to him. He took some time to consider the matter, and at last, being pressed, he said, he would discuss the question with me, and wanted me to go over to the coast with him for that purpose. I was prepared to go, but he was so ill at the time, that he begged me to put it off till he could send me notice ; instead of that he came back himself, and 10 days after that he died. I pressed the same proposals on Syed Burgash, his successor. On the day of his succession, I took the precaution of calling him to the consulate, and having a conversation with him to see what his views were with regard to political matters and the slave trade, for I might have given my support to some other candi date, there being two or three, though he was the strongest claimant to the throne, and he promised everything ; but the very next day he repudiated everything, and said, that he had made no arangement whatever ; that he had never promised anything ; that it was all false, and even had he done so, he was not Sultan then. 316. I suppose you have no doubt if that por tion of the suggested treaty were adopted, con fining the export of slaves absolutely to one point on the coast of Africa, that would, to a very great extent, stop the slave trade ?—It would reduce the slave trade considerably, because the place that has been selected is only about 25 miles from the south end of Zanzibar ; and when the south n’est monsoon blows, no boat could leave Dar Selam and go outside the island ; she would have to go between the island and the main coast, and the steam launch which we pro posed to have there, could prevent all com munication between Dar Selam and the Arabian coast direct; the slavers would have to pass between the islands, and we could put a stop to the traffic. Then there would be a great supervision, because we proposed to have a vice consul at Dar Selam, who would have an eye upon everything that was going on, and would be able to report and prevent any irregularities. 317. What naval force is employed on that part of the coast now ?—I think seven or eight vessels. I am led to understand that the force has been increased lately. I counted seven, the Forte,” the ‘‘ Nymphe,” the “Columbine,” the “Cossack,” the “Bullfinch,” the “Teazer,” and the “ Wolverine.” 318. What is the name of the flagship?—The Forte.” Of course they have other work to perform ; the flagship is mostly on the coast of India. 319. I suppose it is not unnatural that the officers in command of those vessels have all sorts of complaints brought against them of their interfering with legal traffic as well as illegal?— Yes ; and unfortunately many of the complaints are well founded; but I do not think it proceeds from any wish to be unjust on their part, but merely because they do not know a real slaver from a legal trader; they cannot distinguish the difference ; even before my windows at Zanzibar, after I had shown the “Penguin” a slaver, and she was captured in the harbour of Zanzibar, the officers, on their own responsibility, overhauled a dhow that was just coming in, and seized her ; I happened to be looking out of the window, and saw that they had seized a wrong dhow, so 1 got into my boat and went and told them ; but it was with the greatest difficulty that I could persuade them that that was the case, and no doubt had this taken place at a little distance from Zanzibar, the dhow would have been de stroyed, and we should have had a case before the Vice Admiralty Court, of no colours, unsea worthy, destruction of dhow and prize. 320. I suppose, as the officers receive bounty- money, they are interested in destroying as many dhows as they can ?—I do not think that is the inducement. 321. I do not say that that influences them, but still they have a bounty ?—They are very eager, no doubt, to get as many dhows as they can ; it is the eagerness of sportsmen almost ; the men are at the masthead to see whether they can spy a dhow, and they come with the greatest glee to the captain to say that a dhow is in view, and they are very much disappointed if they are not allowed to go after her ; in fact, I have been told by some of the officers command- ing, that it was a very difficult thing for them to keep within the bounds of justice, and not dis satisfy the ship. 322. When slaves are captured, how are they maintained ?—They are maintained on board ship till they are landed by the captain. 323. Does that come ont of the bounty money? —I do not know. I am under the impression that the captain pays for their maintenance, out of the money he receives. They are taken then to the nearest place where they are required, or sometimes where they are not required, for they have been taken to Aden, where they are con sidered a great nuisance. It was proposed to land them at Zanzibar ; but none have been landed ; yet, as the measures that were recom mended by the Committee have not yet been carried out, they had first of all to be accepted by the Sultan, and afterwards the Treasury had to be consulted ; so that in the instructions I received from Lord Clarendon, the question of the landing of slaves at Zanzibar was reserved. 324. What is the cost of the political agency and staff?—I put it down at 3,100?. a year; there are certain contingencies that have not been taken

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