MINUTES OF EVIDENCE TAKEN BEFORE SELECT COMMITTEE 
IÎCV. 
H(et7'e, 
LLD. 
25 July 
1C71.* 
tility of tliat country between Lake Nyassa and 
the sea ?—I have never traversed the country. 
998. With regard to the state of things in 
Zanzibar itself, which is the part of tlie country 
you are most acquainted with, what is the condi 
tion of the emancipated slaves who are living at 
Zanzibar ?—They are exactly in the position of 
free men anywhere; they get their living by 
trading and work. 
999. Is there any attempt made to re-enslavc 
them ?—]^ot generally ; they run some risk if 
they are imprudent and incautious ; sometimes 
a man will sell himself, but, as a rule, they get 
their living in one way or other, and no one 
molests them. 
1000. Is their condition very much better as 
fieed men than it was as slaves?—A.s to eating 
and drinking I should think not much better. 
1001. It is only in having their liberty that 
they are better off?—Only iu having their liberty. 
The greatest evil of the state of slavery is the 
moral degradation. 
1002. With regard to the children, you took 
some interest in the condition of the slaves in 
Zanzioar, I believe ?—Yes, we had some children 
handed over to us who had been taken out of a 
slave dhow. The education of those children 
was our first work in Zanzibar, seven or eight 
years ago. We began with five and have now 
nearly ninety. The first five all came from the 
borders of Lake iSlyassa, and they were very in 
telligent, Our difficulty at starting was in 
regard to the language, and it took some time 
to get over that. We began with the ordinary 
instruction which is given in a national school in 
England, and we found them take it with very 
great rapidity ; they were much more acute than 
our English children would be in a rural 
school, and their moral character was excellent. 
Since I have come back I hear that they have 
gone on acquiring more and more knowledge, 
and the best possible accounts are given of them ; 
some of them are now 20 years of age. 
1003. They have grown up into intelligent 
men and women, able to take care of themselves 
and able to earn an honest living?—Yes. Wc 
have had one or two cases which turned out 
badly, but, as a rule, we have been very satisfied 
with the results. 
1004. ^ Is there any demoralisation amongst the 
young female slaves ?—You may say that in Zan 
zibar morality is unknown, and that, for the most 
part, the slaves arc not married at all. 
1005. With regard to those whom you edu 
cated, some were girls and some were boys ?— 
Some were girls and some were boys. 
1006. With regard to the girls, do you think 
3 on instilled into their minds a proper feeling in 
that respect ?—I think so. I think they have a 
strong moral feeling. 1 do not think there is in 
them any lack of original morality, but, I think, 
owing to the existence of slavery in Zanzibar, the 
general state of morality among the natives is ex 
tremely low, so that if you only look outside your 
own house you find every kind of evil going on. 
1007. You knew the late Sultan of Zanzibar ? 
—Yes; and the present Sultan of Zanzibar also. 
1008. The late Sultan was really anxious to 
put down the slave trade, was he not ?—Yo, I 
should think not. I should think the present 
Sultan much more trustworthy than the last was. 
Seyyid Majid was an effete voluptuary himself, a 
man entirely given up to his jileasures and worn 
out by them, and he was always willing to pa) ; 
money for tlie sake of putting an end to aH) ' 
trouble. 
1009. Toil think that the present Sultan, 
properly approached, would be willing to co 
operate with us in suppressing the slave trade ?'^ 
I think with regard to the foreign slave trad^ 
probably he would. 
1010. Is it, or not, the case that a great pad 
of his revenue is derived from the tax on slaves^ 
—The custom^ duty on slaves forms a materia^ 
part of the customs duties. j 
1011. Would you propose to compensate hii^ 
for the loss of tliat duty ?—lie does not osteO' 
sibly receive any duty upon slaves going 
Arabia, but only upon the slaves carried froa’ 
place to place within his own dominions. 
1012. On the slaves landed in Zanzibar?—Oa 
the slaves landed in Zanzibar and on those eX' 
ported from Zanzibar, exported in a dhow suf' 
posed to be going to one of his own ports. 
1013. So that he does not openly encouragé 
the slave trade ?—^ ot in the least ; he professe* 
to put it down. Every now and then he burns a 
dhow, and imprisons the master of the dhoi'> 
and takes away all the slaves. Seyyid Majid usc^ 
to divide the slaves so taken amongst his friend?' 
1014. Had you any opportunity of forming 
opinion as to the energy of our naval force wff^' ' 
regard to the suppression of the slave trade whe^ 
you were in Zanzibar ?—Yes ; there are exeef' 
tiens, but, generally speaking, I think the nav)' 
did all they could, but I do not think they wef^ 
at all able to do what they might have done? 
I think large vessels are wholly unfitted for tl><^ 
Avork of chasing those dhows ; then Avhen a young 
officer is sent out w ith some seamen in a boah 
nobody ever knows exactly what is done, and 
many tales are told among the natives as to w ind 
is done, Avhich are simply incredible, but there n 
little doubt that Avhen a boat’s crew- goes aw'a) 
they follow- their ow n devices l ery much indeed? 
and, no doubt, they harrass legitimate commercé 
very much. 
1015. Chat is, they take possession of vessel* 
that are in legitimate trade ?—Yes ; they stof? 
and search, and detain, and sometimes burnl’ 
them. 
1016. Under the supposition that they ai'ß 
slave dhoAVs ?—Yes. 
1017. Could you suggest any means of inn | 
proving that state of things for the future ?—Mí j 
impression is that small vessels of light dran | 
should be employed, which could follow- tin’ 
dhows into the shalloAvs, and they ou^ht to 
very fast sailers, because uoav the dhows 
alivays outsail our boats ; if you could folio"' 
them into the shallows with small vessels I ha"^ 
no doubt a great deal of the trade might 
stopped. ® 
1018. Generally, do you look forward w'id' | 
hope to the suppression of the slave trade in it' . 
Avorst form on the East Coast of Africa I thinl^ 
it may be done if the English Government b 
minded to do it. 
1019. If the English Government is minde^ 
think no material opposition Avoid" 
be offered by the natii e princes ?—No. 
'I What w ould you suggest th"^ 
the English GoA erninent should do, supposing the) 
had a inind to do it ?—It is a question for a nav"' 
man what means should be taken ; I thiab? 
probably, the best w ay Avoidd be to Avatch tb^ : 
Arabi^tt