44 
MINUTES OF EVIDENCE TAKEN BEFORE SELECT COMMITTEE 
P.®”’ happen to sight an English steamer at sea the 
C. P. Rigby, slavers frequently cut the throats of the whole 
„ 7~, number of the slaves on board and throw them 
¡^8^; overboard. 
^ ' 562. Then the sufferings of the slaves on board 
are rather increased by our cruisers being sta 
tioned on the coast?—Very much indeed ; there 
is no doubt of it. I remember the case of a 
dhow that was captured in the harbour of Zan 
zibar by the ship “ Lyra.” I had had informa 
tion that that dhow had got slaves on board, and 
just before she sailed I went with Captain Old 
field of the Lyra,” and boarded the dhow. 
There were 112 girls on board her, evidently 
selected to be sold at a high pi ice for the harems 
of Arabia and Persia. The dhow was taken 
alongside the Lyra,” and these slaves were 
taken out. A fatigue party from the Lyra ” 
was sent into the dhow to take out the provisions, 
but each man as he went into the hold of the 
dhow fainted away ; the doctor then gave orders 
that the vessel was to be towed out and scuttled, 
and he said from the frightful stench, and the 
state the dhow was in, if she had gone to sea, 
there could be no doubt that in a week the whole 
of those slaves would have died ; that I think is 
a very common case. They go to sea so ill ju’o- 
vided, that the sufferings of the slaves are very 
great, and particularly if they have put off their 
departure to the last, or if the northern winds, set 
in earlier than usual, and they cannot beat 
up against them ; then the sufferings are 
frightful. 
563. Mr. Shaio L<‘fev)e.~\ What is the average 
length of the voyage to Muscat ?—Thirty to 35 
days; it they have any slaves on board, they have 
to put in at two or three ports for water ; and 
that circumstance gives great facility to our 
cruisers to check the trade, because they have 
only to watch a few ports on the coast to the 
north, and they are sure to catch a great many 
of those dhows. 
564. Chairman^ Do you think by active 
exertions on the part of our cruisers, the trade 
could be prevented, looking at the large profit 
there is on the slaves ?—I have not the slightest 
doubt that within five years it could be entirely 
stopped ; but to stop it, we want what we have 
never yet had, viz., system ; one year you get an 
active officer on the coast, who enters into the 
spirit of the thing, and checks the trade a good 
deal; then he goes away, and another man comes 
with quite different opinions; or you get a captain 
of a cruiser who takes the advice of the Consul 
and pulls with him, and he does a great deal of 
good; and then, perhaps just as he has become 
acquainted with the secrets of the trade, and 
begins to know where the slaves are shipped, and 
where the dhows put in for water, and can dis 
tinguish between a legitimate trader and a slave 
dhow, which it takes a long time to do, he is 
ordered away and never goes back again. 
565. If one slave dhow in five arrived at its 
destination in safety, would it pay for the loss of 
four?—No; I do not think it would. I should 
say that the loss of one would take the profits 
upon four ; because, when you take the price of 
provisions and all together, there is not so much 
profit. 
566. So that if the cruisers succeeded in cap- 
tunng one out of five, you think it would be 
sufficient to destroy the trade?—Yes; I do not 
think they have hitherto captured anything like 
that proportion. 
567. What force has there been on that coast? 
—There has never been any regular squadron 
kept up. ^ When I was there, the squadron that 
the Admiralty sent out was a common cause of 
joking amongst the French, and the Americans, 
and the Germans. That such a squadron should 
be sent out to check the slave trade was an ab 
surdity. There was the “ Sidon,” an old tub, that 
any dhow on the coast could beat ; there was the 
“ Gorgon,” that took 40 days to do 800 miles, and 
vessels of that class, perfectly useless for any other 
service. 
568. Y ou think that the cruisers alone could 
put a stop to the trade ; but does it occur to you 
that any means might be taken to make it the 
interest of the Zanzibar people to put a stop to 
the trade ?—I think the Zanzibar Arabs are now 
fully aware that it will be stopped, and their ideas 
are very different now as to their own interests 
to what they were a few years ago. The late 
Sultan of Zanzibar sent his brother-in-law and a 
cousin on a mission to the Queen two years ago, 
and at the Sultan’s particular request I was ap 
pointed to take charge of the mission. The per 
son who acted as secretary is now the minister 
to the present Sultan, Syed Burgash, and in 
talking with him daily on the subject, he said that 
the Arabs are now beginning to find out that the 
English are quite right, that there is far more 
money to be made by keeping the labourers in 
the country and cultivating the rich valleys by 
their labour, than by selling them out of the 
country. 
569. Mr. Shaw Lefevre.~¡ Would they be em 
ployed as slaves in the country ?—Tljere would 
always be a certain form of slavery on the coast, 
but it is _ not attended with any cruelty. Arabs 
are passionate and hot tempered, but they are 
not cruel to their slaves ; they are nothing like 
the French or the Portuguese in their treatment 
of slaves. 
570. Chairman.'] They would have the power 
of stopping it altogether without our cruisers if 
they were really in earnest, and if they were 
satisfied that it would be to their interest to keep 
the slaves in their own country as labourers ?-— 
The difficulty is that the Zanzibar Arabs are so 
much afraid of these piratical tribes from the 
north, that come down with the north winds in 
great numbers. 
♦571. Who make expeditions into the interior, 
and capture the slaves?—No, those are men of a 
different class, those are half castes, who organise 
those expeditions, and plunder slaves from the 
interior. 
572. They are the men who provide the slaves 
for the northern Arabs?—Yes. 
573. Have ¡you any suggestion to make with 
regard to what might be done in the way of put 
ting a pressure upon the Sultan to induce him 
to put a stop to the trade ?—We have tried all 
sorts of means thiough treaties, through remon 
strances, and through advice, and they have all 
done very little good. From what ï know of 
Syed Bui gash, I do not think he would be sO 
^ ^^^clined to meet our views as the late 
Sultan w^, but I have always been of opinion 
that our Government should put down the slave 
trade with a strong hand. 
574. In what way ?—I wrote out a short ex 
tract from one of Lord Pahnerton’s letters to my 
predecessor, and I often used to read a tranlation 
of it in the “Durbar” to the Sultan, and I often 
gave copies of it in Arabic to the principal 
chief®