10
MINUTES OF EVIDENCE TAKEN BEFORE SELECT COMMITTEE
Hon.
C. Vivian.
10 July
1871.
does not look upon slavery in the light that we
do.
158. You do not think there is any insuperable
obstacle in putting down the slave trade on the
East Coast of Africa?—Not if we were really in
earnest ; of course it is difficult, but by no means
insuperable,
159. Mr. Crum-Ewing.'] Have you any information
as to the manner in which the slaves
are treated after they are sold by the Arabs ?—
I fancy it depends on whose hands they fall into ;
in many cases they fall into good hands ; generally,
in Mahomedan countries, the masters treat
their slaves kindly ; all the cruelty is in bringing
them from the interior.
160. Lord F. Cavendish.] If the treaty you
recommended was pressed on the Sultan of Zanzibar,
do you imagine that he would be likely to
accept it?—Yes, if properly and justly pressed
upon him ; you would have to take into consideration
the serious loss of revenue which the
abolition of the trade would cause to him ; in fact,
it would require money.
161. He would not consent to put an end to
the slave trade within a fixed date without the
payment of a sum of money down?—He would
not consent to give up his right to transport
slaves within the prescribed limits without the
payment of compensation.
162. You stated that there is a great loss of
life when the slave vessels run ashore, in order to
escape our cruisers ; do you imagine that there
are many such cases every year ?—I should think,
taking the whole slave season through, there is
considerable loss of life,
163. Are many more ships run ashore than
captured ?—That 1 cannot tell you.
164. Are the great bulk of these slaves men
or women ?—Men, I believe, but you will get
valuable information upon those points from Mr.
Rothery.
165. Have there been any recent negotiations
with Persia and Turkey on the subject of the
slave trade ?—When we wrote this Despatch to
Mr. Churchill on the 16th of June last, desiring
him to press this treaty upon the Sultan, we at
the same time wrote to Persia and to Turkey,
begging them to act up to their engagements
with us. We have not proposed any new treaty
with them.
166. Have you had any answer from Persia
and Turkey to those communications?—Yes;
we have had a very satisfactory answer from
Persia.
167. What has been the answer from Turkey?
—Turkey is always ready to do what we ask her
when we show her the particular point. If we
point out a particular case, she is always ready to
take means to punish the offender in the particular
case ; but generally, in Turkey, no doubt
they wink at the introduction of slaves.
168. The Imaum of Muscat would have a
greater power of putting down this trade than
anybody else, I presume?—Yes.
169. Has he any pecuniary interest in the
trade?—Yes; I believe there is a tax levied in
Muscat on the import of slaves, just as there is a
tax in Zanzibar on the export of slaves.
170. Would not negotiations with the Imaum
of Muscat seem to promise at least as good a
chance of success as negotiations with the Sultan
of Zanzibar ?—We have the strongest treaty in
the world with him, but it is so much waste paper.
The treaty of 1845 is with the Imaum of Muscat,
because in those days Muscat and Zanzibar were
one.
171. In spite of his evading the treaty, we
compel the Sultan of Zanzibar to continue to
pay over 8,000 Z. a year to the Imaum of Muscat?
—Yes.
172. Chairman.] Have you heard that a number
of slaves, and not an insignificant number,
find their way from Zanzibar to Cuba ?—I have
heard it, but I do not think there is any foundation
for such a statement.
