ON SLAVE TRADE (EAST COAST OF AFRICA). 
83 
1256. Were they vessels engaged in trade?— 
Yes, in legal trade. 
1257. Could you distinguish in those cases 
■""hether the one slave on board was a domestic 
^lave or a slave for sale ?—Yes. 
1258. Would not the presumption he in such 
^ case as that, that the slave was a domestic 
slave?—Yes ; the first presumption is undoubt 
edly that the slave is a domestic slave ; it is only 
On close examination that you come to a different 
Conclusion. 
1259. Were the dhows in those cases carrying 
large cargo ? —A small cargo. 
1260. What was the kind of evidence tending 
to show that they were slaves for sale rather 
than domestic slaves ?—I used generally to in 
timate to the captain before the examination 
began, that if one slave was found to be not 
a domestic slave, his vessel would be legally 
Condemned, to which he always agreed. I used 
to have the captain on board first, and if from 
his replies, or from different circumstances, I 
had any suspicion, I used to send immediately 
tor all the rest of the crew, and separate them 
from one another at once, and then, on examining 
them separately, I generally came at the history 
of the whole transaction. In the case of two of 
those single slaves, they had been both stolen at 
Zanzibar^ and the masters of the dhows admitted 
the fact, and acknowledged that they were pro 
perly captured. 
1261. Sir J. Buy.l In those cases, had there 
been any other slaves killed, do you think, who 
had been part of the cargo before?—I should 
think not. 
1262. Mr. Shaic Ze/erm] Were any of the 
crew domestic slaves ?—Yes, every dhow carries 
domestic slaves as part of the crew. 
1263. Chairman.'] Did you take any of the 
crew to the place where the dhow was con 
demned ? — N one. 
1264. Mr. Kinnaird.] What became of the 
Crew when you destroyed the dhow ?—VYe gave 
them their choice whether they would be landed, 
or whether they should be transferred to some 
other vessel, and they generally chose to take a 
passage in some vessel going to their own place. 
1265. Mr. Shaw Lefevre.] Did the domestic 
slaves in such cases leave their masters?—No. 
1266. Mr. Kinnaird.] What class of people 
are these captains of dhows ; are they superior 
men ? No, quite the reverse ; in the small dhows 
they are the ordinary low class Arab. 
1267. Have they any knowledge of navigation ? 
--None ; they follow the land the whole way up 
from Zanzibar. 
1268. You state that on arriving at the station 
you had no Blue Books placed in your hand, was 
that the case with the squadron generally ?— 
Yes. 
1269. Mr. Shaw Lefevre.] Looking to the in 
efficiency of the interpreters, do not you think 
there is considerable danger in condemning a 
Vessel for having one slave on board?—No, I do 
riot think there is if it is carefully done. 
1270. Looking to the little reliance which can 
he placed on the interpreters, do not you think 
that injustice maybe done in many cases?—I 
think it is very probable in a small minority of 
^^ses. 
1271. Particularly looking at the fact that all 
the crew are domestic slaves as a rule?—Yes; 
hut a violent disease requires a violent remedy. 
1272. Mr. Kinnaird.] Was any request made 
0.116. 
to the commandant of the squadron there to furnish Captain 
to the captains of the vessels information as to P. Colomb, 
what had been done before their arrival at the r.x. 
station ?—I do not know that any official request 
was made to him ^5 July 
1273. You found it a very great drawback that 187^* 
you had no information, and that you had to buy 
your experience from day to day ?—An imm nse 
drawback. Every officer 011 the East Indian station 
was ordered to make a report every six months 
on the slave trade as to what he had been doing, 
and those reports were sent home ; but I am not 
aware of their having been communicated to 
succeeding officers of the squadron. 
1274. Was there any commendation for, or 
special notice taken of, aciiviiy on ihe part of 
any of the officers coiumanding ihe cruisers?— 
My own experience is that it was a little die 
other way. 
1275. You thought that no encouragement 
was given you?—I speak, of course, of what 
happened to myself ; I had one or two letters 
from the Foreign Office which were not com 
mendatory, but the reverse. 
1276. So that there was rather discouragement 
than encouragement, in putting down the slave 
trade ?—So far as my own experience goes. 
1277. Practically you believe that our officers, 
generally speaking, do exercise a very wise dis 
cretion, and it is your impression that there has 
been no unnecessary act of cruelty on their part, 
or any unnecessary destruction of dhows?—None 
whatever, so far as I could judge, while I was on 
the station. I thought there was quite as much 
discretion used as could be ; that when mistakes 
were made they were mistakes of ignorance, and 
nothing else, and that there was no want of zeal 
or want of proper care. 
1278. Did you ever trace the fate of those 
slaves which you landed at Aden?—I never 
traced the fate of individuals, but hearsay evi 
dence goes to show that slaves landed at Aden 
really find their way into Arabia as slaves : at 
Aden there is no means of disposing of them. 
They are sent from time to time to Bombay, but 
the feeling in India was very strong against that 
step being taken. 
1279. Do I rightly gather that your impres 
sion is, that there is an utter want of system in 
the whole arrangements for putting down the 
slave trade, owing to our not giving pro¡ier in 
structions to the squadron ?—I will not go so far 
as to say that there is an utter want of system ; 
but I think the system might be improved. 
1280. Have you any suggestions to make to 
the Committee with respect to those slaves that 
are landed at Aden, and which find their way 
back and are recaptured ?—I have always thought 
that the worst thing that could happen to a slave 
was to be captured by one of Her Majesty’s ships; 
because there is no opening for him after that. 
He spends a happy time on board the ship ; but 
his after career is quite a doubtful one. 
1281. Mr. Shaw Lefevre.] That would be an 
argument in favour of stopping the trade at the 
ports of embarkation, rather than at the ports of 
debarkation?—Yes, possibly. 
1282. Having undergone the hardships of the 
40 days’ voyage, you think they are better off by 
remaining uncaptured ?—Yes, 
1283. You think that their lot as liberated 
slaves is rather worse than their lot as slaves in 
Arabia?—I think so. 
1284. Mr. Kinnaird.] Suppose by treaty you 
L 2 ■ secured