64
MINUTES OF EVIDENCE TAKEN BEFORE SELECT COMMITTEE
Sir
ly, Coghlan.
<24 July
1871.
894. Supposing its reconsideration came before
the Imperial or the Indian Government, do you
think it should be decided on its own merits or
mixed up with the slave question?—On its own
merits, I think ; though I was reporting on the
slave traffic, my principal business was the adjustment
of affairs between the two Sultans. The
slave traffic was merely a matter thrown .in.
895. Mr. Kinnaird!\ It was not for want of
representation, I think, from the Indian Government
that that opportunity was missed ; it was
the Home Government who neglected the opportunity
?—I understand (in fact, some papers were
sent to me on the subject) that the Governor
General decided that it must be paid.
896. His view being that it was a dynastic
arrangement ?—Yes.
897. When you returned to Aden, in 1863,
three years subsequent to your report, did any
additional evidence come before you at all to
alter your report?—Nothing at all: in fact, the
only way in which the question of the slave trade
was mentioned to me on that occasion was by a
complaint from some of the native merchants,
who said that their traffic was interfered with by
the cruisers ; they did not complain of the operation
of the law ; they did not complain of vessels
being interfered with which really carried slaves;
but they said, in some cases, vessels which carried
no slaves were condemned, and with them
all evidence of their character ; therefore, they
said we are afraid to send our ships to sea.
898. Do you believe, from your residence in
the East, that a very large legitimate trade would
grow up, if the slave trade was put down?—I
have no doubt that there would be a large development
of trade on that coast.
899. Have you any suggestions apart from
your report to make, as to the best mode of suppressing
the slave trade ?—Obviously the first
would be to get the Sultan of Zanzibar to cancel
the treaty by which he is allowed to carry slaves
within his own dominions.
900. If he agreed only to have one port of export,
which could be watched, would not that greatly
facilitate the suppression of the trade ?—It would
be still better to have none ; Sultan Majid, the
one who died a few months ago, agreed with me
that it should be so; he said, I will do anything
you please, only I request you to remember that
this forms a sixth part of my revenue.
901. If our Government undertook to free him
from that liability to pay 8,000 Z. a year, would
he agree to the treaty being altered, and abolish
the slave trade?—I should, think he would for
less than that ; he said to me that this formed
one-sixth part of his revenue; say that 19,000
slaves were imported into Zanzibar ; upon that
19,000 he got two dollars a head, that is 38,000
dollars, that would be 7,000 Z. or 8,000 Z.
902. Would that, in your opinion, be a very
good mode of stopping the slave trade ?—I think
so ; General Eigby is a better authority upon
that subject than I am.
903. Would not the relieving him from the
payment of the amount of the subsidy be much
cheaper than keejiing a large squadron on the
coast ?—Yes.
904. Mr. ./. Talhot.~\ Would it prevent the
necessity of keeping a squadron on the coast?—
Perhaps not altogether, because people would be
found to break the law ; in fact, Europeans
would do it. One of the greatest slave trafficker^
of my day was a Spaniard ; I saw his vessel cap'
tured with^860 slaves on board.
905. Mr. Crum-Ewing.~\ Where was he taking
them to ?—I saw the vessel just after she wacaptured
at the Mauritius.
906. Were they taking them to Cuba?—Yes.
907. Mr. Kitinaird.l What date was that?—
About August or September I860; she was ^
large ship, captured by the Brisk.”
908. Have you any reason to believe that ther®
is even now a trade in slaves from the East Coasl
of Africa to Cuba ?—I have no means of forming
an opinion upon that.
909. Sir J. Hay.~\ Is not the great difficult)
in stopping the slave trade there more than
any other place ; the difficulty in distinguishing
between domestic slaves and slaves intended fot
sale in foreign ports ?—That would be a difficult)'
to naval officers, but during the time that I w»’
at Aden there was no difficulty of that sort!
almost all the country craft that came into tb^
harbour were navigated by slaves ; we nevot
thought of interfering with them ; but if a vessel
had come in with slaves for sale, we should nt
once have seized her,
910. Mr. Crum~EwÙ7g.'\ You are of opinio^
that we cannot terminate the subsidy now paid to
the Imaum of Muscat ?—I think not
911. Is there no termination to it at all?-"
When I made the award, I looked to a perio«^
when the two Governments would fall into onO
hand as before, under the father; that was alwa)'^
looked to as a possible contingency. That, oí
course, would have smoothed the difficulty oí
once.
912. Mr. jP. TVynd]iam.~\ Do you think thoi
the Sultan of Zanzibar is likely now to be satis'
tied with the same sum that you think wouD
have satisfied him previously as a compensatio^
for giving up the slave trade ?—I think so. ^
found him tractable.
913. You have no reason to believe that tb^
trade is more valuable to him now ?—No.
914. Mr. Crum-Eicirg.~\ The Imaum of MuS'
cat would look to the Sultan of Zanzibar in tb^
first instance for the payment of his subsidy?-^
Yes; there is no longer an Imaum of Muscat!
he is the Sultan of Muscat ; of course he wouD
look to his brother, but it is morally guarantee*^ j
by the British Government.
915. Mr. Kennaway.'] Did the Sultan of ZaH'
zibar, in any conversation he had with you with
reference to the slave trade, contemplate the po5' '
sibility of its being put down ?—Yes, I put tb^ :
question to him, and you will find a reference
it in my report.
916. Did he see any difficulty in its being pn^
down ?—No ; he said I will do whatever yo^l
please, only give me your support, by which 0*
course I understood he meant money.
917. Chairman.'] Not merely moral support- '
—No ; I quite understood he meant by that, that '
he wanted to be indemnified.
918. Mr. Kennaioay.] Would he have be^^
satisfied with a few old arms ?—No, he had pleut)
of them.
919. Chairman.] Ig there anything you w'isb
to add to the evidence you have given ?—I lua/
mention that, so far as the native chiefs withi*^ t
the Gulf of Aden are concerned, I made a treat/
with, I think, every one of them ; I visited evef)
